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Post by JAYJAYSTRIPES on Dec 6, 2010 7:13:01 GMT -5
The Lions this year seem to be shell shocked, they carry a lead into the 4th quarter and then totally fall apart. Witness the fiasco against the Jets, a 10 point lead with a miute and a half to go, and lose the game. As an aside, i don't think the officials are used to the speed and skill of Suh and Mike Oehr, they are so quick I think the guys get caught off guard and flag them for stuff that in real time looks good, but then look at replay and see it wasn't. Oehr hit the line so quick last night he got flagged for NZI, and even the announcers said was it or wasn't it? Suh's call is still debatable in my mind. But that's my intrepretation. We're taught to see the WHOLE play before we throw the flag....has the NFL enviornment the guys are working under caused them to get a bit flag happy? This remains to be seen.....things don't seem to be as cohesive as in years past. What does Johnson have to do to get the guys back on track? I'm sorry I have a lot of questions, and not many answers.
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Post by melkaman8200 on Dec 6, 2010 8:24:56 GMT -5
The Lions this year seem to be shell shocked, they carry a lead into the 4th quarter and then totally fall apart. This is "classic Lions." Many years ago, they'd always find a way to lose after the two-minute warning, whether it was failing to score or failing to hold another team. More recently, they haven't played at all. It's kind of nice to see the old Lions back. We're taught to see the WHOLE play before we throw the flag....has the NFL enviornment the guys are working under caused them to get a bit flag happy? This remains to be seen.....things don't seem to be as cohesive as in years past. What does Johnson have to do to get the guys back on track? I'm sorry I have a lot of questions, and not many answers. There may be something to this. The NFL has gotten very safety-minded in protecting the players and I think that it has led to a system where if you think it's a foul, you call it. I can't say I noticed a lack of cohesiveness, but I do see a lack of consistency. I have no idea how Carl Johnson will handle this, but he will have to find a way. I don't know what his previous leadership experience is, but he certainly has his work cut out for him. The NFL is rapidly changing.
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Post by JAYJAYSTRIPES on Dec 6, 2010 8:27:09 GMT -5
Mel, consistency is a better word Thanks!
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Post by FredFan7 on Dec 6, 2010 10:08:42 GMT -5
I respectfully disagree with your comments regarding the McFadden DPI if you are talking about the one where he gave a two hand shove to the Baltimore WR, forcing him out of bounds. Had he not done that I thought it was a catchable ball. Remember, the standard for catchable is not just where the player is/where the ball lands, but rather had the WR's process not been impeded by the DPI was the ball catchable. Even if you said uncatchable that was still clearly illegal contact which is an automatic first down, though not a spot foul I agree. At the very least, it was illegal contact, five yards and an automatic first down.
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Post by FredFan7 on Dec 6, 2010 10:12:14 GMT -5
The Lions this year seem to be shell shocked, they carry a lead into the 4th quarter and then totally fall apart. This is "classic Lions." Many years ago, they'd always find a way to lose after the two-minute warning, whether it was failing to score or failing to hold another team. More recently, they haven't played at all. It's kind of nice to see the old Lions back. We're taught to see the WHOLE play before we throw the flag....has the NFL enviornment the guys are working under caused them to get a bit flag happy? This remains to be seen.....things don't seem to be as cohesive as in years past. What does Johnson have to do to get the guys back on track? I'm sorry I have a lot of questions, and not many answers. There may be something to this. The NFL has gotten very safety-minded in protecting the players and I think that it has led to a system where if you think it's a foul, you call it. I can't say I noticed a lack of cohesiveness, but I do see a lack of consistency. I have no idea how Carl Johnson will handle this, but he will have to find a way. I don't know what his previous leadership experience is, but he certainly has his work cut out for him. The NFL is rapidly changing. You may be onto something here.
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Post by zcr57 on Dec 6, 2010 10:41:36 GMT -5
Here's how I grade the crews that I saw yesterday:
Coleman (WSH @ NYG): A-. They called a pretty good game, and both wing officials did a good job of holding their whistles on fumbles. The only reason they get an A- is because Coleman's mic work wasn't very good at times.
Parry (OAK @sd): A-. Again, the crew called a great game, and did an excellent job in the 2nd half with only 6 officials on the field. The deep officials got a workout. They get a "-" for wearing long sleeves in 70+ degree weather.
McAulay (PIT @ BAL): B-. It was a well-managed game, but the crew made a few errors in judgment, especially on the Heath Miller hit. The game was choppy during the 1st quarter, but it improved as the game went on.
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Post by zcr57 on Dec 6, 2010 10:50:29 GMT -5
The Lions this year seem to be shell shocked, they carry a lead into the 4th quarter and then totally fall apart. This is "classic Lions." Many years ago, they'd always find a way to lose after the two-minute warning, whether it was failing to score or failing to hold another team. More recently, they haven't played at all. It's kind of nice to see the old Lions back. We're taught to see the WHOLE play before we throw the flag....has the NFL enviornment the guys are working under caused them to get a bit flag happy? This remains to be seen.....things don't seem to be as cohesive as in years past. What does Johnson have to do to get the guys back on track? I'm sorry I have a lot of questions, and not many answers. There may be something to this. The NFL has gotten very safety-minded in protecting the players and I think that it has led to a system where if you think it's a foul, you call it. I can't say I noticed a lack of cohesiveness, but I do see a lack of consistency. I have no idea how Carl Johnson will handle this, but he will have to find a way. I don't know what his previous leadership experience is, but he certainly has his work cut out for him. The NFL is rapidly changing. Agreed with both of you. In my mind, there should only be a flag if there is no doubt that there is a foul on the play. I think that we're starting to see to many officials err on the side of safety, and it's leading to several misguided flags being thrown.
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Post by mike on Dec 6, 2010 11:00:15 GMT -5
Here's how I grade the crews that I saw yesterday: Coleman (WSH @ NYG): A-. They called a pretty good game, and both wing officials did a good job of holding their whistles on fumbles. The only reason they get an A- is because Coleman's mic work wasn't very good at times. I got a kick out of Washington being called Denver. If there was anything to give them a slight downgrade over it was the fact that I thought a couple of delay of game calls were not made when the clock ran out. Though since it happened multiple times I think it might either be a single official issue or the clock shown on screen was wrong. I will reserve judgment at this time. I do think Roy Ellison deserves credit for spotting a facemask in a group of players that was there but not for an extended period of time that it should have been seen. It was the proper call to make and shows why Ellison is regularly among the top rated U's in the NFL
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Post by becky10 on Dec 6, 2010 12:41:50 GMT -5
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Post by FredFan7 on Dec 6, 2010 13:08:06 GMT -5
Parry (OAK @sd): A-. Again, the crew called a great game, and did an excellent job in the 2nd half with only 6 officials on the field. The deep officials got a workout. Why'd they go with six?
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Post by zcr57 on Dec 6, 2010 14:22:28 GMT -5
Parry (OAK @sd): A-. Again, the crew called a great game, and did an excellent job in the 2nd half with only 6 officials on the field. The deep officials got a workout. Why'd they go with six? Perry Paganelli didn't come out after halftime. I didn't notice it until the 4th quarter, and another member who was at the game confirmed that they worked the entire 2nd half with only 6 guys (see bige's post on the 2nd page of this thread). Hopefully all is well with Perry P.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2010 14:49:07 GMT -5
I respectfully disagree with your comments regarding the McFadden DPI if you are talking about the one where he gave a two hand shove to the Baltimore WR, forcing him out of bounds. Had he not done that I thought it was a catchable ball. Remember, the standard for catchable is not just where the player is/where the ball lands, but rather had the WR's process not been impeded by the DPI was the ball catchable. Even if you said uncatchable that was still clearly illegal contact which is an automatic first down, though not a spot foul Agreed with the above. As soon as Tomlin was doing the uncatchable sign, i was like, its definitely catchable. I also agree on the Ngata and McClain hits, as both should have been flagged. Ngata's hand straight slapped Big Ben's facemask and rotated it enough to break his nose. Perhaps McAulay or the Umpire back there thought it was in the motion of the attempted sack, but I still think it needs to be called. (And i am the guy who hates all the QB rules like the "tom Brady" rule and such...)
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Post by melkaman8200 on Dec 6, 2010 14:59:59 GMT -5
to add.... When Suh was getting up from the Forearm to Cutler's Head.. Suh also pushed Cutler's head/helmet into the turf... Hochuli didn't call that, he called the tackle itself. If he had called the pushing Cutler's head at the end, which is actually what I thought the flag was for when I saw it live, then I don't think there would be nearly as much as an issue. However, Suh was called for the forearm, which he objectively didn't do. Now, from Hochuli's point of view, and in real time, one can see how the penalty was called as a judgement call erring on the side of safety. It does look like a forearm tackle, but we can see that it isn't. This is the point of contention. A concern is developing on these forums (and I'm sure in the NFL as well) that officials are calling games too tight in the name of safety and it's a delicate balance. At what point will calls become phantom calls because an official thinks there was a foul, and what happens if officials swallow their flag when they should throw it, encouraging later illegal hits? I'm sure Carl Johnson will address this if they have Official Review this week, and I hope he offers something more than "it's a judgement call and we won't question that," because although it explains Hochuli's flag, it doesn't get to the heart of the matter.
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Post by plbell627 on Dec 7, 2010 9:05:48 GMT -5
Well the NFL did penalize both Ngata he got $15.000 and McClain got $25,000 maybe this will wake people to these kinds of cheap shots, But I doubt it will.
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